How to slow down the Patriots?

observer · Joined: 22 Aug 2007 Posts: 2

---

Can the Cowboys -or- Colts -or- any other team for
that matter accomplish this over an entire game?

---
by Brian Baldinger
http://www.sportingnews.com/yourturn/viewtopic.php?t=298576
---

Complete article:

This is not a column about Tom Brady's greatness. It's about
his vulnerability. He might actually have one. Maybe.

Watching the Patriots on film, I noticed a commonality on the
seven occasions Brady was sacked heading into last week's
game. Each time, it was with a five-man rush. That's signifi-
cant because I think it's the best -- and maybe only -- way to
prevent Brady from standing in the pocket and scanning the
field. That's when he's unstoppable.

A four-man rush will never get to Brady. A six- or seven-man
rush will leave targets such as Randy Moss and Wes Welker
in single coverage. But a five-man rush allows a team to
match up in coverage against the alignment that has pro-
duced 18 of Brady's 30 touchdown passes this season:
three wideouts, one tight end and one running back.

A five-man rush leaves six defenders to handle four receivers.
You start by double-covering Moss and Welker. It would be
nice to double up on Donte' Stallworth, but if you have to pick
your poison, his inconsistent hands make him the guy to man
up on. And tight end Benjamin Watson gets a single defender.

In terms of handling Moss and Welker, you must have stout,
capable corners, such as the Colts' Marlin Jackson and Kel-
vin Hayden, and a hard-hitting safety who can cover, such
as Indy's Bob Sanders. You stand a chance with this cover-
age.

But only if the pass rush can collapse the pocket at all. That
requires an edge rusher who can win a one-on-one matchup
-- say, the Colts' Dwight Freeney or Robert Mathis. The idea
is to make Brady move in the pocket, take his eyes off his
first and second reads and hold the ball longer than he wants
to. If his pass protection breaks down even a bit, maybe you
can negate a couple of the big plays that have been helping
the Patriots average 41 points a game.

That's what it will take to beat the Patriots. They'll go 16-0 if
they keep scoring at that rate because nobody can score
42 points on them. You'll have to keep the score in the 20s
to make a game of it. Indianapolis has the personnel to do
that. A couple of other teams, too.

The formula for tripping up Brady is out there; it's on tape.
It's just a matter of whether any team can execute it con-
sistently.

--- end of article ---

Archived from group: alt>sports>football>pro>dallas-cowboys

Beiselbub© · Joined: 06 Aug 2007 Posts: 7

On Nov 2, 11:54 am, "Allenx" wrote:

>
> > Watching the Patriots on film, I noticed a commonality on the
> > seven occasions Brady was sacked heading into last week's
> > game. Each time, it was with a five-man rush. That's signifi-
> > cant because I think it's the best -- and maybe only -- way to
> > prevent Brady from standing in the pocket and scanning the
> > field.

Common sense: get pressure with the fewest number necessary. However,
you can't fall into a habit of predictably rushing five, or the Pats
will just run you out of it. Where does the five man pressure come
from? Is that fifth man a LB, a corner or a safety? You have to do a
good job of disguising that or the Pats will adjust, audible and find
the weakness. Who is responsible for blitz pickup? The pats generally
don't go from an empty set, so you have to send someone big enough or
fast enough to get past the chip block/blitz pick up. I don't
disagree with the statement that a five man rush is a good approach if
implemented properly, I simply don't think it is as simple as a
numbers game. There is no one-size fits all solution: the Pats would
eat you alive once they identified what you were doing. I think a
zone blitz, even strength, or even numbers up, is more optimal. The
Pats are too well coached, the key to any effective defense is not to
be predictable, and to execute well. That is easier said than done.

jstrazz · Joined: 06 Aug 2007 Posts: 2

On Nov 2, 1:54 pm, "Allenx" wrote:

> > Watching the Patriots on film, I noticed a commonality on the
> > seven occasions Brady was sacked heading into last week's
> > game. Each time, it was with a five-man rush.

It was a reasonable article. The fact that the only times Brady has
been sacked this year have been against five-man rushes could be
important.

But, it leaves out something - how often have the opponents rushed
five and not sacked Brady? And, when that happened, what was the
result of the play?

It might be fun to see the Colts rush five most of the time. It's
quite possible they could get 3 sacks - and lose by 30.

Beiselbub© · Joined: 06 Aug 2007 Posts: 7

On Nov 2, 1:29 pm, jstrazz wrote:
> On Nov 2, 1:54 pm, "Allenx" wrote:
>
> > > Watching the Patriots on film, I noticed a commonality on the
> > > seven occasions Brady was sacked heading into last week's
> > > game. Each time, it was with a five-man rush.
>
> It was a reasonable article. The fact that the only times Brady has
> been sacked this year have been against five-man rushes could be
> important.
>
> But, it leaves out something - how often have the opponents rushed
> five and not sacked Brady? And, when that happened, what was the
> result of the play?

Good point. How many times have they rushed six (or seven)? If five
is the most they send, it stands to reason that is where they would
have success.

Allenx · Joined: 16 Aug 2007 Posts: 9

This is an excellent, well reasoned
article.

"observer" wrote in message @y42g2000hsy.googlegroups.com...
>
> ---
>
> Can the Cowboys -or- Colts -or- any other team for
> that matter accomplish this over an entire game?
>
> ---
> by Brian Baldinger
> http://www.sportingnews.com/yourturn/viewtopic.php?t=298576
> ---
>
> Complete article:
>
> This is not a column about Tom Brady's greatness. It's about
> his vulnerability. He might actually have one. Maybe.
>
> Watching the Patriots on film, I noticed a commonality on the
> seven occasions Brady was sacked heading into last week's
> game. Each time, it was with a five-man rush. That's signifi-
> cant because I think it's the best -- and maybe only -- way to
> prevent Brady from standing in the pocket and scanning the
> field. That's when he's unstoppable.
>
> A four-man rush will never get to Brady. A six- or seven-man
> rush will leave targets such as Randy Moss and Wes Welker
> in single coverage. But a five-man rush allows a team to
> match up in coverage against the alignment that has pro-
> duced 18 of Brady's 30 touchdown passes this season:
> three wideouts, one tight end and one running back.
>
> A five-man rush leaves six defenders to handle four receivers.
> You start by double-covering Moss and Welker. It would be
> nice to double up on Donte' Stallworth, but if you have to pick
> your poison, his inconsistent hands make him the guy to man
> up on. And tight end Benjamin Watson gets a single defender.
>
> In terms of handling Moss and Welker, you must have stout,
> capable corners, such as the Colts' Marlin Jackson and Kel-
> vin Hayden, and a hard-hitting safety who can cover, such
> as Indy's Bob Sanders. You stand a chance with this cover-
> age.
>
> But only if the pass rush can collapse the pocket at all. That
> requires an edge rusher who can win a one-on-one matchup
> -- say, the Colts' Dwight Freeney or Robert Mathis. The idea
> is to make Brady move in the pocket, take his eyes off his
> first and second reads and hold the ball longer than he wants
> to. If his pass protection breaks down even a bit, maybe you
> can negate a couple of the big plays that have been helping
> the Patriots average 41 points a game.
>
> That's what it will take to beat the Patriots. They'll go 16-0 if
> they keep scoring at that rate because nobody can score
> 42 points on them. You'll have to keep the score in the 20s
> to make a game of it. Indianapolis has the personnel to do
> that. A couple of other teams, too.
>
> The formula for tripping up Brady is out there; it's on tape.
> It's just a matter of whether any team can execute it con-
> sistently.
>
> --- end of article ---
>

warthog0 · Joined: 28 Sep 2007 Posts: 4

On Nov 2, 1:54 pm, "Allenx" wrote:
> This is an excellent, well reasoned
> article.
>
> "observer" wrote in message
>
> @y42g2000hsy.googlegroups.com...
>
>
>
> > ---
>
> > Can the Cowboys -or- Colts -or- any other team for
> > that matter accomplish this over an entire game?
>
> > ---
> > by Brian Baldinger
> > http://www.sportingnews.com/yourturn/viewtopic.php?t=298576
> > ---
>
> > Complete article:
>
> > This is not a column about Tom Brady's greatness. It's about
> > his vulnerability. He might actually have one. Maybe.
>
> > Watching the Patriots on film, I noticed a commonality on the
> > seven occasions Brady was sacked heading into last week's
> > game. Each time, it was with a five-man rush. That's signifi-
> > cant because I think it's the best -- and maybe only -- way to
> > prevent Brady from standing in the pocket and scanning the
> > field. That's when he's unstoppable.
>
> > A four-man rush will never get to Brady. A six- or seven-man
> > rush will leave targets such as Randy Moss and Wes Welker
> > in single coverage. But a five-man rush allows a team to
> > match up in coverage against the alignment that has pro-
> > duced 18 of Brady's 30 touchdown passes this season:
> > three wideouts, one tight end and one running back.
>
> > A five-man rush leaves six defenders to handle four receivers.
> > You start by double-covering Moss and Welker. It would be
> > nice to double up on Donte' Stallworth, but if you have to pick
> > your poison, his inconsistent hands make him the guy to man
> > up on. And tight end Benjamin Watson gets a single defender.
>
> > In terms of handling Moss and Welker, you must have stout,
> > capable corners, such as the Colts' Marlin Jackson and Kel-
> > vin Hayden, and a hard-hitting safety who can cover, such
> > as Indy's Bob Sanders. You stand a chance with this cover-
> > age.
>
> > But only if the pass rush can collapse the pocket at all. That
> > requires an edge rusher who can win a one-on-one matchup
> > -- say, the Colts' Dwight Freeney or Robert Mathis. The idea
> > is to make Brady move in the pocket, take his eyes off his
> > first and second reads and hold the ball longer than he wants
> > to. If his pass protection breaks down even a bit, maybe you
> > can negate a couple of the big plays that have been helping
> > the Patriots average 41 points a game.
>
> > That's what it will take to beat the Patriots. They'll go 16-0 if
> > they keep scoring at that rate because nobody can score
> > 42 points on them. You'll have to keep the score in the 20s
> > to make a game of it. Indianapolis has the personnel to do
> > that. A couple of other teams, too.
>
> > The formula for tripping up Brady is out there; it's on tape.
> > It's just a matter of whether any team can execute it con-
> > sistently.
>
> > --- end of article ---

A few days ago somebody posted stats of Brady's completion percentages
and average yards per pass vs different numbers of rushers. The
numbers were rather startling as there was essentially no difference
between 4, 5 and 6 rushers.

As far as keeping the score in the 20's, nobody has been able to do it
yet. Saying that xyz team has the personnel to do it is a pipe dream.
The Colts gave up 34 the past two times these teams played, and that
was with a far inferior set of wide receivers than the Patriots line
up now. It is very reasonable to expect the Patriots to score 40+
against the Colts, and in the process of doing so keep the ball long
enough so that the defense does not get worn out.

And as far as defensive backfield makeup. don't the Redskins have four
first round draft picks playing in their secondary, including Shawn
Taylor who is every bit as good as Bob Sanders?

You might be able to contain Moss and Welker, but what do you do about
Faulk/Maroney/Watson/Stallworth? That is still one good and two
excellent receivers that are on single coverage. And then there is the
question of whether doubling Moss is enough. We have already seen him
score several touchdowns while double covered this year.

Preacher · Joined: 28 Sep 2007 Posts: 50

observer wrote:
> ---
>
> Can the Cowboys -or- Colts -or- any other team for
> that matter accomplish this over an entire game?
>
> ---
> by Brian Baldinger
> http://www.sportingnews.com/yourturn/viewtopic.php?t=298576

The Tanya Harding/Jeff Gillooly approach has as good a chance as any.

These guys look awfully good and if the Colts don't do it, I think the
only thing that can stop the Pats is themselves.

TXRhody · Joined: 06 Aug 2007 Posts: 80

"Allenx" wrote in message @corp.supernews.com...
> This is an excellent, well reasoned
> article.

Really? A five-man rush? That's not the answer. I can think of a few reasons
other teams haven't just used a five-man rush on every play.
1. The Patriots don't always line up with four WRs.
2. Even when the Patriots do line up with four WRs, a five-man rush doesn't
account for Faulk out of the backfield on screens and circle routes.
3. Even doubling Moss and Welker on one side leaves Stallworth available on
the other side for quick hitches or slants.
4. Sometimes, about 48% of the time, the Patriots will run the ball.

TXRhody · Joined: 06 Aug 2007 Posts: 80

Another point is that Tom Brady currently has been sacked 8 times, which has
him tied for 10th fewest. Now, some of the 9 QBs ahead of him are Matt
Leinart, Steve McNair, Kurt Warner, Kyle Boller, Tavaris Jackson, Trent
Green, and Vince Young. Really, the only full-time starters ahead of him are
Drew Brees and Peyton Manning. My point is that 8 sacks is a relatively
small sample size. So this guy noticed a commonality. So what? There are so
many other things to consider that I bet this is a coincidence.