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Tight end likely high on Packers wish list
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nerdmann



Joined: 06 Aug 2007
Posts: 57

PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2008 4:43 pm    Post subject: Tight end likely high on Packers wish list Reply with quote

http://www.packersnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080222/PKR01/802220705/1989

Tight end likely high on Packers wish list

Position is a deep one in this year's college draft

By Pete Dougherty
pdougher@greenbaypressgazette.com


INDIANAPOLIS - The Green Bay Packers' tight ends haven't been much more than
on the periphery of the passing game since Mark Chmura and Keith Jackson
formed the NFL's best tandem at that position in 1996.


In 2000, former General Manager Ron Wolf tried to upgrade the position when
he drafted Bubba Franks with the 14th pick overall to replace Chmura. But
Franks, despite three Pro Bowl berths at a time when the NFC was slim at
that position, never was more than a solid blocker and good red-zone threat
because of his limited speed and quickness.


However, now that Franks is gone - the Packers released him this week -
Wolf's protégé, GM Ted Thompson, has a chance to make tight end a much
bigger threat in his team's offense because of an unusually deep draft class
at that position. The Packers return Donald Lee as the starter after signing
him to a contract extension last season, and Thompson might have the chance
to replace Franks at backup with a quality prospect who even could push Lee
for a starting job.


The position is important in coach Mike McCarthy's offense, because a
skilled tight end can force defenses to make hard personnel decisions, and
also because the Packers play in the NFC North Division, in which the other
three teams run the Tampa-2 defense. One of the best ways to beat that
scheme is with a tight end who has the athletic talent to run down the
middle seam.


With that in mind, and with the way this year's draft class is shaping up,
there's a chance Thompson could end up using a valuable first- or
second-round draft pick at tight end.


"I think it's deep," said Scot McCloughan, the San Francisco 49ers' general
manager, of this year's class of tight ends. "But the thing that's unique
about it is a lot of these colleges are going to those three and
four-receiver sets, spread offenses, and you're not seeing the prototypical
tight end on the line of scrimmage next to the tackle. You're seeing flexed
formations, and they're more used as receivers than they are as blockers.
So, you're getting a lot more guys coming out in the draft that have
production, caught a lot of passes, run a lot of routes, run after catch.
You're not getting many guys that are blockers."


Tight ends were the first position group, along with some offensive linemen,
to get weighed and measured at the NFL scouting combine here Thursday,
though workouts for scouts don't begin until Saturday.


Many NFL teams don't like to draft tight ends in the first round unless the
player is an exceptional talent, such as Vernon Davis as the sixth pick
overall in 2006 or Kellen Winslow Jr. as the sixth pick overall in 2004.
However, one NFL draft bromide is that from picks 20 through at least 40 in
any given year, there's usually not an obvious difference in the quality of
prospects available, so taking a tight end late in the first round isn't as
risky as taking one in the top 15, like former GM Ron Wolf did when he
selected Franks.


In the past five years, only seven tight ends have been first-round picks.
Besides Davis and Winslow, there was Greg Olsen by Chicago (31st overall)
last year, Mercedes Lewis by Jacksonville (28th overall) in 2006, Heath
Miller by Pittsburgh (30th overall) in 2005, Ben Watson by New England (32nd
overall) in 2004 and Dallas Clark by Indianapolis (24th overall) in 2003.
Six more tight ends combined came off the board in the second round of those
drafts.


"You could do it (later in the first round)," another scout said. "It's like
taking a guard. But nowadays, with a tight end, if you use him right, he
could catch 70, 80 balls."


This year, there are no tight end prospects like Davis or Winslow who will
go in the first half of the first round. In fact, there's at least a chance
all of the tight ends will be available when the Packers select at No. 30
overall.

Top tight end prospects

The following is a thumbnail look at seven tight-end prospects who appear to
have the best chance of getting selected in the first and second rounds of
this year's NFL draft.
Since the common draft began in 1967, the most tight ends selected in the
first two rounds in any year was six, in 1974. Five were selected four other
times: 2006, 1995, 1978, 1974 and 1973.

Jermichael Finley, Texas
6-4˝, 243
A redshirt sophomore who is entering the draft early, could be the first
tight end off the board, depending on how his physical testing and
background check. (Teams often don't get background checks on underclassmen
until after the combine.) The University of Texas has a reputation for
coddling their players, so many come out with questions about their maturity
and work ethic, and that includes Finley. He averaged 12.8 yards on his 45
receptions last season and could end up running the 40 in just over 4.6
seconds. "He's so damned athletic, he's got so much physical skill he can be
damn good," one scout said. "But it's going to take him some time. He's not
very physical at all (as a blocker), though, and he probably never will be."

Martellus Bennett, Texas A&M
6-7, 248
A junior entry who averaged 12.0 yards on 49 receptions, scored 10 career
touchdowns and played basketball for Texas A&M. Had two ankle injuries last
season but should be a first-round pick because of his complete game unless
something comes up in his medical or background checks. Has excellent size
and might run under 4.7 seconds in the 40-yard dash. "Big (guy)," another
scout said. "And he moves well for that size. He's the type of guy that's
the full package - blocking, receiving, the whole thing."

John Carlson, Notre Dame
6-51/8, 251
Could go as high as late in the first round. Averaged 9.3 yards on 40
catches last season for a Notre Dame team that had major problems getting
him the ball. Had an excellent junior season (13.5-yard average on 47
receptions) with Brady Quinn as his quarterback. "He's the type of guy I
think someone is going to steal," one scout said. "They're going to get him
in the second round, and he's going to be a damn good player."

Fred Davis, Southern Cal
6-3, 255
Probably the most publicized tight end going into the offseason, and many
teams consider him the best prospect at the position after he led USC with
64 receptions for a 14.2-yard average last season. Has good speed but lacks
ideal height and strength. "I think Davis falls in the second. He's not much
of a blocker," one scout said. "He's a good athlete, and he can catch the
ball."

Dustin Keller, Purdue
6-2, 242
Among the top prospects at tight end, he's by far the shortest, which will
concern many teams. Didn't block much in college but averaged 13.0 yards on
68 receptions as a senior and caught 56 passes as a junior. One scout ranked
him as the third-best tight end and compared his ability to run after the
catch to Alge Crumpler, the 35th pick of the 2001 draft who went to four
straight Pro Bowls but was cut this offseason by the rebuilding Atlanta
Falcons. Another scout thought taking Keller late in the first round would
be too high. "I think he's going to run really fast and you'll hear people
talk about him up there," the scout said. "But on the (game) tape he
probably doesn't deserve to be. (Chicago's) Greg Olsen ran 4.4 last year,
and this guy plays faster than Greg Olsen."

Martin Rucker, Missouri
6-5, 248
One scout rated him as a solid second-round prospect and considered him
better than Tennessee's Brad Cottam after Rucker caught 84 passes as a
senior and 184 in his final three seasons in Missouri's spread offense. But
another scout considered him more of a product of Missouri's system. "He's
OK," the scout said. "He's not real fast or quick. Third or fourth (round).
Not a big fan."

Brad Cottam, Tennessee
6-7˝, 270
A huge specimen who runs routes like a smaller man, but has a limited resume
because of injuries. Played in only the final four games of last season
after breaking his wrist at the end of training camp; finished the season
with five receptions for a 25-yard average. Averaged 13.0 yards on 14
catches as a junior. Despite his limited production, could be a second-round
pick. "You'd never know he's that big. He moves around damn good," one scout
said. "Very interesting guy. Another guy I think is going to be a good NFL
player."
- Pete Dougherty, pdougher@greenbaypressgazette.com

Archived from group: alt>sports>football>pro>gb-packers
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nobody



Joined: 21 Jan 2008
Posts: 11

PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2008 5:45 pm    Post subject: Re: Tight end likely high on Packers wish list Reply with quote

Too bad they didn't draft one in last years draft. You know - a position of
NEED.
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PC



Joined: 06 Aug 2007
Posts: 4

PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2008 8:58 pm    Post subject: Re: Tight end likely high on Packers wish list Reply with quote

grinder@o-yoohoo.edu wrote:
> Too bad they didn't draft one in last years draft. You know - a
> position of NEED.

If you bothered to read the article instead of talking out your butt you
would know this is a much better draft class than last year. Donald Lee did
quite nicely in 2007.

Who would you give up for an average tight end that was drafted last year?
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nerdmann



Joined: 06 Aug 2007
Posts: 57

PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2008 10:23 pm    Post subject: Re: Tight end likely high on Packers wish list Reply with quote

JUSTIN HARRELL!



"PC" wrote in message @corp.supernews.com...
> grinder@o-yoohoo.edu wrote:
>> Too bad they didn't draft one in last years draft. You know - a
>> position of NEED.
>
> If you bothered to read the article instead of talking out your butt you
> would know this is a much better draft class than last year. Donald Lee
> did quite nicely in 2007.
>
> Who would you give up for an average tight end that was drafted last year?
>
>
>
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PC



Joined: 12 Jan 2008
Posts: 16

PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2008 10:28 pm    Post subject: Re: Tight end likely high on Packers wish list Reply with quote

'nerdmann' decided to chime in with:
> JUSTIN HARRELL!
>

Yeah he would say that. Which would be ludicrous, of course.
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iarwain



Joined: 06 Aug 2007
Posts: 68

PostPosted: Sat Feb 23, 2008 2:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Tight end likely high on Packers wish list Reply with quote

> Which would be ludicrous, of course.

Ludicrous is a bit of a stretch. I understand you don't agree with
him, but it's not like the earth would have caved in if we hadn't
picked Justin Harrell.
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mtfester



Joined: 06 Aug 2007
Posts: 429

PostPosted: Sat Feb 23, 2008 10:48 pm    Post subject: Re: Tight end likely high on Packers wish list Reply with quote

PC wrote:
> grinder@o-yoohoo.edu wrote:
> > Too bad they didn't draft one in last years draft. You know - a
> > position of NEED.

Like cornerback?

> If you bothered to read the article instead of talking out your butt you

wouldn't post.

> would know this is a much better draft class than last year. Donald Lee did
> quite nicely in 2007.

C'mon; we NEED a real TE. Someone who can rate, oh, #6 among NFL TEs in
TDs, be in the top 10 in catches and yards, maybe even a deep threat
who could lead the league in catches over 40 yards for TEs.

> Who would you give up for an average tight end that was drafted last year?

Average? Who was average out of last year's class? Miller was the best.

Mike
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PC



Joined: 12 Jan 2008
Posts: 16

PostPosted: Sat Feb 23, 2008 5:10 pm    Post subject: Re: Tight end likely high on Packers wish list Reply with quote

'iarwain' decided to chime in with:
>> Which would be ludicrous, of course.
>
> Ludicrous is a bit of a stretch. I understand you don't agree with
> him,

Picking an average TE over the prospect of an excellent DT *is* ludicrous.
To be fair, I still have not heard who he would have taken instead of
Harrell.

> but it's not like the earth would have caved in if we hadn't
> picked Justin Harrell.

I never suggested such a thing. Usenet and hyperbole can never be divorced
it seems.
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PC



Joined: 12 Jan 2008
Posts: 16

PostPosted: Sat Feb 23, 2008 5:12 pm    Post subject: Re: Tight end likely high on Packers wish list Reply with quote

'mtfester@netMAPSONscape.net' decided to chime in with:

>
>> would know this is a much better draft class than last year. Donald
>> Lee did quite nicely in 2007.
>
> C'mon; we NEED a real TE. Someone who can rate, oh, #6 among NFL TEs
> in TDs, be in the top 10 in catches and yards, maybe even a deep
> threat who could lead the league in catches over 40 yards for TEs.
>

Sure, that would be nice. Who should have we drafted last year to serve
that need?

>> Who would you give up for an average tight end that was drafted last
>> year?
>
> Average? Who was average out of last year's class? Miller was the
> best.
>

Perhaps I am being too kind.
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mtfester



Joined: 06 Aug 2007
Posts: 429

PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2008 4:34 am    Post subject: Re: Tight end likely high on Packers wish list Reply with quote

PC wrote:
> 'mtfester@netMAPSONscape.net' decided to chime in with:

> >
> >> would know this is a much better draft class than last year. Donald
> >> Lee did quite nicely in 2007.
> >
> > C'mon; we NEED a real TE. Someone who can rate, oh, #6 among NFL TEs
> > in TDs, be in the top 10 in catches and yards, maybe even a deep
> > threat who could lead the league in catches over 40 yards for TEs.

> Sure, that would be nice. Who should have we drafted last year to serve
> that need?

Actually, those were Lee's rankings.

> > Average? Who was average out of last year's class? Miller was the
> > best.

> Perhaps I am being too kind.

No, they might pan out; but the two "best" TEs in last year's draft
managed to help their teams win a combined 11 games.

Mike
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iarwain



Joined: 06 Aug 2007
Posts: 68

PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2008 1:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Tight end likely high on Packers wish list Reply with quote

> Picking an average TE over the prospect of an excellent DT *is* ludicrous.

I could be wrong, but I didn't think nerdmann's comment necessarily
meant a 1:1 trade - Harrell for a TE. The Packers could have taken
someone else instead of Harrell, maybe a RB. Then in the second
round, instead of Brandon Jackson, taken a tight end. I was leaving
some wiggle room. But I don't necessarily think Harrell was a bad
choice, so it's not really my argument. Last year wasn't a good year
for TEs, as has been noted.
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nerdmann



Joined: 06 Aug 2007
Posts: 57

PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2008 4:30 pm    Post subject: Re: Tight end likely high on Packers wish list Reply with quote

> I could be wrong, but I didn't think nerdmann's comment necessarily
> meant a 1:1 trade - Harrell for a TE. The Packers could have taken
> someone else instead of Harrell, maybe a RB. Then in the second
> round, instead of Brandon Jackson, taken a tight end. I was leaving
> some wiggle room. But I don't necessarily think Harrell was a bad
> choice, so it's not really my argument. Last year wasn't a good year
> for TEs, as has been noted.


NERD: i was being sarcastic. i believe harrell will take that step up this
offseason. but yeah, a 1:1 trade isnt realistic there. but i believe TT
did right.
nerdmann
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nobody



Joined: 21 Jan 2008
Posts: 11

PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2008 2:40 pm    Post subject: Re: Tight end likely high on Packers wish list Reply with quote

"nerdmann" wrote in message @comcast.com...
> JUSTIN HARRELL!
>
>

Maybe they should move him to T.E.
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nobody



Joined: 21 Jan 2008
Posts: 11

PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2008 2:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Tight end likely high on Packers wish list Reply with quote

"PC" wrote in message @comcast.com...
> 'iarwain' decided to chime in with:
>>> Which would be ludicrous, of course.
>>
>> Ludicrous is a bit of a stretch. I understand you don't agree with
>> him,
>
> Picking an average TE over the prospect of an excellent DT *is* ludicrous.

Excellent? I thought he picked Harrell.
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nobody



Joined: 21 Jan 2008
Posts: 11

PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2008 2:45 pm    Post subject: Re: Tight end likely high on Packers wish list Reply with quote

"PC" wrote in message @corp.supernews.com...
> grinder@o-yoohoo.edu wrote:
>> Too bad they didn't draft one in last years draft. You know - a
>> position of NEED.
>
> If you bothered to read the article instead of talking out your butt you
> would know this is a much better draft class than last year.

I saw an article where they said ALL the tight ends should be available with
the 30th pick which would indicate the class won't have any standouts.

Donald Lee did
> quite nicely in 2007.
>

Certainly much much much better comparitively than Harrell.

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